Choose Your Fictions Well

By now, hopefully, you have read Peter Ludlow’s account of recent events in Second Life and perhaps have also followed along with the comments and disputes that have surrounded this post. By now, hopefully, you’ve started to form your own opinion about what happened, why it happened, what it all means, and perhaps, what constitutes the borders between griefing and anti-griefing in this context. The following set of comments were crafted between Ludlow and myself as we reflected on these events and what they may tell us about the interplay between fantasy and politics in virtual worlds. We hope it will provide a springboard for further discussion both on this blog and elsewhere.

Choose your fictions well.

by Henry Jenkins and Peter Ludlow

In 2004, the two of us spent a lot of time reflecting on the Alphaville elections in The Sims Online. Those elections culminated in a contest between the self-declared incumbent Mr-President and Ashley Richardson, an avatar guided by a 14 year old girl from Palm Beach Florida. Initially, both of us marveled over the intensity of political activity surrounding the campaign, including a debate on national radio, and then, the aftermath of those elections, when it was discovered that the voting system had been rigged on Mr-President’s behalf by notorious Alphaville mafioso, JC Soprano.

Coming so shortly after the 2000 elections, there was a sense that even in play, American democracy was broken. That was our first thought. But as we looked more closely, we discovered that the two candidates were playing very different games, understanding their investments in this online game world in very different terms — one earnestly seeking to represent the interests of her constituency as if this were a student government election being played out on a much larger scale, the other playing a game where his transgressive fantasies of being a corrupt politico in a world controlled by organized crime could be more fully explored.

The problem was that the open-ended structure of The Sims Online, which both was and was not a game, and which supports, like James Paul Gee suggests, multiple sets of goals and multiple paths to success, did not force players to actively negotiate between competing perceptions of what was going on. Both could play their own games, explore their own fantasies, and it became an issue because their actions impinged on each other’s experience and impacted a much larger community of players. In other words, at least two different games collided in that moment.

As we flash forward to this new set of entanglements involving the Justice League in Second Life, we are struggling to figure out if we’ve made any real progress – in terms of making more explicit the competing frames of play which shape our experiences of online worlds, in having conceptual models which help us to figure out how seriously to take player’s actions within virtual worlds, or even in terms of making real any hopes we have that virtual worlds can allow us to experiment with alternative models of what democracy looks like. Clearly, Second Life is if anything even more open ended than Sims Online in terms of its capacity to support participants with very different orientations and interests. It is perhaps the best embodiment of what Yochai Benkler talks about in The Wealth of Networks — a place where differentially motivated groups and individuals co-exist within a mixed media ecology or a shared virtual world. Clearly, both the Alphaville elections and the recent JLU incident in Second Life reflect this feature of virtual worlds –different goals and narratives can coexist — but apparently they cannot coexist peacefully indefinitely. Eventually the diverse goals and narratives collide.

Colliding narratives are a matter of routine in large virtual sandboxes like Second Life. Furries collide with Goreans, and both collide with military roleplay groups. In one famous case reported in the Alphaville Herald, a group of refugees from World War II Online colonized Second Life and soon came into conflict with a virtual gangster known as One Song and his plans to build a megamall next to their WWII roleplay sim (a conflict which led to One Song torching their headquarters — a scale model of the Reichschtag — which in turn led the WWII Onliners to dress as jihaddists and attack One Song’s cybersex brothel, eventually taking it offline for a while). Even the military roleplay groups can come into conflict, as when one roleplay army attacked a space age Second Life army using only muskets.

Of course whether the goals and narratives are in collision, it is fair to say that not all of them are created equal. Some are praiseworthy and some demand reflection and critique.

Consider the praiseworthy first. We are interested in the ways that participatory culture can pave the way for greater civic participation and political engagement. The point of interest is the trajectory which takes a young person from being engaged creatively and expressively with a popular culture phenomenon to being courted as a potential activist whose actions matter in the “real world.” For example, consider how the members of the Harry Potter Alliance have sought to make real the fantasy identities constructed around “Dumbledore’s Army” in the J.K. Rowling books — seeking to model their real world efforts at social change on the representations of activist identities constructed across the Harry Potter franchise, including organizing public interventions in the guise of “House competitions.”

Or we might point to the ways that indigenous groups and environmental activists in many parts of the world (China, Brazil, the Middle East) have adopted the identity of the Na’Vi from James Cameron’s Avatar as a mask through which to engage in real world interventions. Doing so gives them an empowering fantasy which can shape their own behavior and doing so can deploy a shared vocabulary of images which may generate much greater media attention. There is of course a long history of adopting the mask of the “other,” or even fictional identities, in the name of social change. Isn’t there a similarity to be drawn between painting yourself blue as a Na’Vi and painting yourself red for the original Boston Tea Party? Utilizing the trappings of fictional narratives can empower us to do things in the real world that perhaps we otherwise could not.

It is easy to see that the JLU incident in Second Life began with a similar sort of motives; clearly being a superhero in Second Life was an empowering fantasy for the participants. It allowed them a model of what meaningful intervention might look like and they were able to map that model onto the politics of Second Life in ways that made them feel heroic and larger than life, which empowered them to take action on behalf of their communities. Yet, at the same time, what we see is that it matters what fantasy provides your starting point.

As a long time comics fans, we can’t help but note that the Justice League offers a problematic set of fantasy identities — certainly a different set of utopian visions of political transformation, than say the characters within the Marvel Universe. The problem is that there is a kind of moral certainty which runs through the DC universe — a sense that good guys can do no wrong, a troubling alignment of their interests with those of the state (“truth, justice, and the American way”), and a representation of pure evil in the form of the bad guys, all of which attract people with a certain way of seeing the world.

Reflecting on the consolidation of data in the JLU wiki and the violations of expectations about privacy, we cannot help but think of the ways the recent Dark Knight movie dealt with precisely the same issues: Batman can solve crimes more quickly if he can deploy surveillance equipment to spy on the citizens of Gotham City yet he faces an ethical debate about whether it is the right thing to do. The film ends up allowing him to spy on the public this one time, not to mention to take such actions as kidnapping business leaders, yet he pays a price in terms of moving back into the shadows, falling out of the good graces of the public.

It is worth pondering whether such fantasies entered into the mind of Kalel Venkman, as he pushed his campaign against griefers further and further. And we wonder what would have happened if the popular culture which inspired his particular kind of role play had adopted a different set of ethical and political values. We might ask “Who Watches the Watchmen?” though we are also reminded of Spider-man’s “With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility.” Both Watchmen and Spider-Man offer more complex representations of what motivates superheroes to act and what factors can or should offer a check on their relentless war against the bad guys? The problem with Superman, oddly enough, was diagnosed by Lex Luthor himself (in the recent movie), in a passage that Haruhi Thespian quoted when he informed the JLU that he was working for their enemies at Woodbury University: “Gods are selfish beings who fly around in little red capes and don’t share their power with mankind. No, I don’t want to be a god. I just want to bring fire to the people. And… I want my cut.”

Many of the revisionist superhero fantasies which came out of the 1980s — including those by Frank Miller and Alan Moore — raised the question of whether superheroes helped to create the villains they battled or at least attracted them to particular geographic locations. Think about the Batman/Joker relationship: “You created me and I created you,” Tim Burton told us. Would there be costumed bad guys if there were no costumed good guys?

The Superhero’s battle against evil becomes meaningless if there is no more evil to be battled. And so this revisionist argument goes, the Superhero starts to manufacture villains for his or her rogues gallery to fight, or perhaps, in the more fascistic versions of the superhero genre, starts to project evil onto innocent bystanders. Would the Woodbury campus on Second Life even exist without Kalel Venkman as an enemy? Woodbury leader Tizzers Foxchase has confided that he uses Kalel to keep the Woodbury kids engaged and to prevent their virtual campus from turning into the ghost town that most virtual campuses have become.

So, again, we can see what happened here as an outgrowth of a particular kind of fantasy being played out in the virtual world. Maybe Kalel Venkman even took a certain pleasure in “crossing lines,” moving from the pure virtue of the classic DC superheroes towards a darker vision of the dark knight working from the shadows, doing what constitutionally regulated authorities could not do, in order to redeem a world which is otherwise beyond hope.

That said, we can only speculate on what sort of civic fantasies are at play here — for example, what fantasies motivate the various griefer groups (the W-Hats, the channers etc) as they seek to get their LOLs by engaging in what they surely know is anti-social behavior? There is often a sense that virtual worlds allow us to enact transgressive fantasies freed of their real world consequences and if anyone objects, they are just taking things too seriously. This takes us all the way back to Julian Dibbel’s “A Rape in Cyberspace” and the debate about Mr. Bungle the Clown and whether his actions are simply a form of nasty-minded play or whether they can be understood as “rape” by those most invested in their characters and the integrity of their virtual community.

On the other hand, perhaps the greifer memes about “serious business” do offer an important counterpoint to the corporate take-over of the internet. Maybe someone should take issue with the corporatist narrative about the purpose of the world wide web by offering that it ought also to be a place for play and silliness. Whether or not such lines of defense are exculpatory, they are certainly taken on by griefers, as interview after interview with griefers in the Herald has shown.

For that matter, what kinds of civic fantasies have governed the Woodbury group, with their sense of rightous indignation at being falsely accused, with their efforts to plant spies in Kalel’s headquarters and thus flirt with risk? Or for that matter, what about the Alphaville Herald‘s conception of itself as a muckraking publication trying to rip the masks off the members of the Justice League? Are they all playing different games here or does each contribute something to the game which the others need in order to work through their fantasies, a warped version of Richard Bartle’s ecology of player types?

Our point is not that these competing narratives are wrong or disingenuous, it is rather that they need to be investigated and critiqued, for these are the narratives and strategies for play that are weaving the foundations not just for virtual worlds but for our future online lives. And of course, as cases like the Harry Potter Alliance show, they also motivate our “real life” actions and attitudes.

No doubt by this point some readers are thinking that all of these people have too much time on their hands, that they are taking events in virtual worlds too seriously. This criticism actually packs two criticisms within it. First, there is the assumption that the virtual world itself is of little interest. Second there is the assumption that only the confused would use fictional narratives and trappings guide their real lives. On this latter point, no one who is using Harry Potter or the Na’vi to inspire their real life actions is confused into thinking they are wizzards or very tall blue extraterrestrial beings. Similarly, Kaleel Venkman presumably does not believe he has superman powers. These features of fictional characters do not transfer into the real world. Clearly. But what does transfer are the norms, attitudes, virtues and vices of these characters. We cannot jump over tall buildings with a single bound, but we can adopt Superman’s ideas of what is right and his sense of self-certainty. The question, of course, is whether we *ought* to adopt such norms and attitudes.

As for the first question — whether what transpires in virtual worlds matters — this is a question that could have been intelligibly raised several years ago, but not today. Virtual worlds are rapidly becoming important platforms for work, socializing, education, and play, and given the amount of time that our children will spend in such worlds it is important to reflect on the norms that are being uploaded into those worlds today.

Clearly for virtual worlds to work they have to be open to play and experimentation, which requires suspending some of the rules that govern real world civic life. Yet, at the same time, some forms of political play fray the social contract which holds the world together, disrupting the experience of others, and destroying the infrastructure they all need in order to have meaningful experiences there. The story of the JLU invites us to ask the question — at what point did the campaign against griefers become itself a kind of griefing, which did more to damage than to defend the integrity of other participant’s virtual lives? Or to put it another way, the sandbox can allow many forms of roleplay and many competing narratives, but when the game becomes too big it impinges on the play and narratives of others. Playing well together is something we were supposed to have learned in kindergarten, but as this story shows, doing so is not as easy as it seems.

Comments

  1. Suzanne Aurilio says:

    Thanks Henry for this post. This conversation is important, because yes yes what happens in virtual worlds does matter, and these incidents bear witness to something disturbing in our virtual social worlds—regressive social and civic relations. Warzone comes to mind. No… it’s more like an adolescent-male ideology has emerged. A postmodern hegemony, where we can spew and spar at length about the cruelty inherent in our relations, yet never call it that.

    I’m conflicted with my social role, as an educator and instigator, who also happens to lead an initiative in Second Life. From a purely institutional perspective, it’s a problematic context, as you’ve evidenced. I don’t endorse it for classes across the board because I see it first as a cultural milieu with all its’ trappings. I find it interesting and somewhat disconcerting how tolerant educators in SL are of these trappings. There is no critical discourse to my knowledge about them. On the one hand, there exists an evangelical insistence that students are really engaged, and thus (falsely concluded) really learning in-world. On the other, I wonder if there is a neglect of basic human rights and the personal safety of students to not be subjected to racist, sexist and homophobic attacks while “in school.”

    Put another way, here’s what you might find on the syllabus of an SL course.

    Disclaimer:

    I’m convinced you’ll find this course in Second Life enriching beyond compare. However, I cannot take responsibility for your mental or emotional safety or comfort. Those of you who are women, people of color, gay or transgender should know that you may become victims of hate crimes. Don’t worry, they’re not really directed at YOU, because griefers (the criminals) don’t really know who YOU are, unless of course you don’t want to hide behind your avatar, and you make your avi look and act identical to the real you. (This is not recommended.) For those of you who have been victimized by hate crimes, rape and war, and for whom such attacks might trigger strong reactions, you might consider taking Mr. Smith’s class, which meets at the same time, in Room 222.

    I love Second Life for the all-wordliness, play and learning it engenders. Its creative potential alone amazed me enough to study it, which is when I was able to identify what you’ve described as Residents doing their own fiction. I had several different encounters with it and although the theme wasn’t the thrust of my research I filed the observations away as something significant. Another filed away observation was “life-circumstances”–the materiality of the person at the keyboard (I studied avatars) and implications of that for the future. Both observations illuminate some of the layers of complexity added to the human virtual experience.

    I think the educational community on the whole is not ready to notice this. Those of us technology-oriented educators tend to get wrapped up in the tool and applications discourses, in particular those related to distance education currently. In short, Second Life is a applied not lived.

  2. IntLibber Brautigan says:

    I really have to wonder where Suzanne has been hanging out in SL. I’ve operated both male and female avatars in the conduct of my business over three years in SL, and I can say that none of my female avatars have ever been subject to a sexist attack.

    The only real racism I’ve seen is the bigotry of groups like the JLU against black avatars.

    As for “homophobia”, evidently Suzanne isn’t aware that on the internet, the word “fag” isn’t a referent to homosexuality, it’s a referent to someone who is lame or being a jerk. There’s a South Park (“The F Word”) episode about it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_F_Word_%28South_Park%29 which she is free to study at length for its artistic challenge to our society.

  3. William Marshall says:

    Professor Jenkins,

    My name is William Marshall, a senior in New York University’s Journalism program (I’m also double majoring in Comparative Literature, with a minor in Steinhardt’s Media, Culture and Communications program).

    I am currently in an honors advancement reporting class finishing my senior thesis about the intersection between virtual worlds (I’m concentrating on Second Life) and real-world issues and institutions. It will appear in the online publication Shoeleather Magazine (www.shoeleathermagazine.com) in early May and run about 8,000 words.

    So far I have dealt with the relationship between the consumption of virtual goods and tangible goods, copyright infringement, the DMCA and piracy in virtual worlds and my last section is on anti-social behavior like griefing, , which I am finishing up now.

    I read your recent blog posts “Watching the Watchers” and your collaborative statement with Ludlow “Choose Your Fictions Well” and am delighted to see that you and Ludlow have been following the same issues of governance in virtual worlds and have arrived at some of the same conclusions that resonate with what I have been writing for my thesis.

    As I said, I am in the process of editing and finalizing it (tentatively titled “Second Life: Virtually Real or Really Virtual?”) but would love to include some more of your thoughts on anti-social behavior , specifically griefing and on the difficulty presented by such open-ended platforms like Second Life in my final draft.

    Would it be possible for you to answer a couple questions via phone or email (whichever is easier) about this? If so, I would really appreciate it.

    Thank you for reading,

    William Marshall

    P.S. On a separate note, I am planning on applying to Masters Programs in media studies or communications for 2011. Both my parents teach at MIT and I have begun to look into their Comparative Media Studies program, which you directed. I would love to pick your brain about it.

  4. William Marshall says:

    Professor Jenkins,

    My name is William Marshall, a senior in New York University’s Journalism program (I’m also double majoring in Comparative Literature, with a minor in Steinhardt’s Media, Culture and Communications program).

    I am currently in an honors advancement reporting class finishing my senior thesis about the intersection between virtual worlds (I’m concentrating on Second Life) and real-world issues and institutions. It will appear in the online publication Shoeleather Magazine (www.shoeleathermagazine.com) in early May and run about 8,000 words.

    So far I have dealt with the relationship between the consumption of virtual goods and tangible goods, copyright infringement, the DMCA and piracy in virtual worlds and my last section is on anti-social behavior like griefing, , which I am finishing up now.

    I read your recent blog posts “Watching the Watchers” and your collaborative statement with Ludlow “Choose Your Fictions Well” and am delighted to see that you and Ludlow have been following the same issues of governance in virtual worlds and have arrived at some of the same conclusions that resonate with what I have been writing for my thesis.

    As I said, I am in the process of editing and finalizing it (tentatively titled “Second Life: Virtually Real or Really Virtual?”) but would love to include some more of your thoughts on anti-social behavior , specifically griefing and on the difficulty presented by such open-ended platforms like Second Life in my final draft.

    Would it be possible for you to answer a couple questions via phone or email (whichever is easier) about this? If so, I would really appreciate it.

    Thank you for reading,

    William Marshall

    Email. wam247 at nyu dot edu

    P.S. On a separate note, I am planning on applying to Masters Programs in media studies or communications for 2011. Both my parents teach at MIT and I have begun to look into their Comparative Media Studies program, which you directed. I would love to pick your brain about it.

  5. Henry and Peter,

    It looks like you have taken a large drink of the Kool Aid. Tizzers Foxchase/Tizzy Teardrop and the Woodbury University group were removed from Second Life today.

    A statement from Tizzers at http://woodbury.su/ hardly shows him to be a kind and gentle student, but rather one full of hate who wants to watch the world burn. Figuring he told a major corporation that: “Woodbury will be a thorn in the side of Linden Lab until the day they close their doors” hardly shows them to be of good standing while the legal team shuts them down.

    It is sad as you have not taken your own advice and choose some poor fictions on the reality of Woodbury in Second Life.

    -Bob

  6. Leigh Ankersen says:

    Interesting post. Thank you so much for sharing.

  7. Nika Talaj says:

    “Our point is not that these competing narratives are wrong or disingenuous, it is rather that they need to be investigated and critiqued, for these are the narratives and strategies for play that are weaving the foundations not just for virtual worlds but for our future online lives.”

    Professor Jenkins, if this is truly your interest than I fail to see why you are spending so much time following Peter Ludlow’s fascination with post-adolescent ‘acting out’ behaviors within SL.

    SL is full of viable communities whose only purpose is to provide fun or challenging play and recreation. Are they less interesting to you because they are less dysfunctional? Because they are not self-avowedly anarchistic, as 4chan is? Because their definition of ‘play’ is not particularly disruptive to other netizens?

    As Bob states above, Linden Lab has evidently failed to see the cosmic significance of the painfully puerile machinations you are chronicling, and nuked them. So, WU is gone, and the JLU will have to find some other activity. RIP. That only leaves the other 99.999% of the entertainment/play groups on the grid for you to analyze.

  8. Politics and fantasy in virtual worlds are just that: virtual. They have no real effect on people. By real, I mean they bear no physical or emotional consequences. I don’t understand why people would let them effect them so much as to dwell on a virtual world.

    One day, people will start to understand the true meaning of virtual. I would never advocate any type of degrading, but will also continue to take every thing and one in virtual reality as just that.

  9. retrobob says:

    Hi, I think your site might be having browser compatibility issues. When I look at your blog in Safari, it looks fine but when opening in Internet Explorer, it has some overlapping. I just wanted to give you a quick heads up! Other then that, fantastic blog!

    walking shoes

    walking shoes

    walking shoes

  10. joshabrams says:

    There’s typically a sense that virtual worlds allow us to enact transgressive fantasies freed of their actual world consequences and if anyone objects, they’re simply taking things too seriously.http://jennairgasgrillsreviews.org

  11. robie evans says:

    Digital worlds are rapidly turning into important platforms for work, socializing, schooling, and play, and given the period of time that our youngsters will spend in such worlds you will need to reflect on the norms which can be being uploaded into these worlds today. Used Riding Lawn Mowers For Sale

  12. Lol.. nice one “the sims online” thx btw..superheroes will always be a “trend” film topic.. only change the super heroes dress and evil and uve got a new film. forex trade signals

  13. Your article is great. Actually, the casts in the story are classified in different characteristics. Thanks for your sharing.

    John from SEO

  14. I just want to add more information about my opinions above. Harry Potter is a great edition that is made of film. It has many meaningful things inside.

    John from dich vu seothiet ke websitemarketing onlinehoa tuoi

  15. Ysl shoeshas changed the face of web hosting industry in a major way, people were paying gold for peanuts . cheap hosting has become synonym with Yves saint laurent shoes, anybody and everybody who wants a reliable and affordable domain web hosting visits Yves saint laurent and gets either Yves Saint Laurent Boots or Yves Saint Laurent Pumps from UCVHOST. UCVHOST sells cheap hosting WITHOUT hidden terms and conditions where as competition has huge MSA and SLA’s which are good enough to confuse a seasoned awyer also. For clients by now Business with us for the value of Yves Saint Laurent Sandals became very critical piece of puzzle for their whole operation, uptime and performance became a huge concern.. However it came with a cost, dedicated servers proved to be at least 100 times expensive in comparison to any windows or Linux plans. Our Yves Saint Laurent Slingbacks platform is all geared up in fight of pips, our platform support any number of expert advisory (EA) and along with an assure of 100% uptime. Our Virtual Forex Trading Terminals are well equipped to help you in making money .

  16. I just want to say that, i don’t know why whenever i comment on this website, my comment disappear after 2 or 3 days.

    download film

    cach tao blog

    free backlinks

  17. Its creative potential alone amazed me enough to study it, which is when I was able to identify what you’ve described as Residents doing their own fiction. I had several different encounters with it and although the theme wasn’t the thrust of my research I filed the observations away as something significant…forex trading

  18. Post is nicely written and it contains many good things for me. I am glad to find your impressive way of writing the post. Now it become easy for me to understand and implement the concept. Thanks for sharing the post. burberry outlet go how to lose weight fastdffCoach Outlet eos cpap machine

  19. Second Life is one of the best books i´ve read. Really good and nice article about it.

    Hotell Stockholm

  20. thanks for posting this great stuff!

  21. Women are born to beautiful, born of shopping,.Go shopping in people's eyes is women's patent as if .Now a new choice for women is going to Coach Factory Online.If you want to buy Coach Poppy Bag or Coach Wallet, but don't want to go out, Coach Factory Outlet must be your best choice, why buy Coach from us? Because we have all kinds of Coach products,and these products are high quality and low price.Coach Factory provide the most perfect service, your order will arrive about 5~7days.Free shipping any order of $99+. Coach bags sell 75% off which in Coach Factory Online Are you still hesitate? To click on your mouse to choose your like.Welcome to Coach Factory Outlet!

    Coach Outlet Online is coming this world now!Coach bags,most famous brand in usa,also the world,why are coach spread so wide,that is because cheap with fashion,the reason why is so cheap because coach always have Coach Outlet,Coach Outlet Online is the Online shop of Coach Bags,and they take their product all is from Coach Outlet Online Store,no tax no room rent is the advance of Coach Outlet Online Store,so come and shopping us now,beautiful bag are waitting for you.

    Everybody should have a beautiful Coach Bag.Where can we buy Coach Outlet bags? A lot of people choose to go to Coach Outlet Store Online.All products what sale in Coach Outlet Online are top quality and low price.We promise you to recieve your buy about 5~7days. Coach Outlet Store Online directly sell for customers.Do you want to free to buy Coach Bags in your home?Please click Coach Outlet Online.

    Coach Outlet Store Online is cheapest mall to bought Coach bags,as a famous brand in the world,have discount is a incredible thing.Find Coach Outlet Online is a new way to get Coach Bags,Coach Outlet Online obviously is a perfect way to get it,in this winter are you really ready to be a fashion women,Coach Outlet will help you,so join us now! Coach Outlet Store Online wating for you comeing!

    Hermes Handbags is the most valuable bag in fashion world, as the world’s most expensive brand, if you have one, that must stand that you are a good station person in your country, Hermes is famous of it’s Hermes Handbags , as the hermes handbag’s high qulity and best design, maybe the price is the best in the world.Two series of hermes is popular, that is Hermes Kelly Bags , and Hermes Birkin Bags , this two series make Hermes more popular, so visit our site to get elegant Hermes Bags.

    Louis Vuitton Online Store are amazing shopping site in this world, because through it, you can bought the Louis Vuitton Outlet handbag in an incredible price, maybe a new way to get Louis Vuitton Outlet Handbag, that is Louis Vuitton Online Store, as I understand they take the bag from Louis vuitton factory, no tax, no house rent, no compete, these make the price lower then louis vuitton shop, so why not shop the Louis Vuitton Online, amazing Louis Vuitton handbag are belong to you.

    Belstaff Jackets is the most popular winter brand in the world,if you don't know,that means you out.Belstaff Coat is famous of its high-level material and fahisonable design,so that's why so many people choose Belstaff to though the cold winter.Nowaday surffing the internet is the lifestyle of most people,but have you bought things on the internet,I introduce you to try to buy things in the internet,because you can buy Belstaff Sale on the internet,that way you can get big discount than in reality world,in the brand Belstaff Jacket series is the hottest,this series suit for all kinds of people,whatever you like,whatever you are,you suit it,so buy Belstaff Jackets on internet now,you will shocked for it.

    The winter is comming,have you prepared to pass the winter,I think a Moncler Jackets is necessaery,Online Moncler is a good way to get a perfect Moncler Jackets way,Moncler is famous of it amazing qulity and it's consummate manual work,when you ware it,you will feel warm,whatere how cold the winter is,Moncler can take care of your body.Our Online Monclerafford latest Moncler Coat,so in the cold winter you can also fashion and attractive,so visit our Moncler Online Shop,it will take you a warm winter.

    The chrishmas is comming,do you want to make your holiday colourful and unexpensive,yes,Hermes Handbags is waiting for you.maybe Hermes Handbags is very expensive,but you will be interisted in our Replica Hermes Handbags,we have Hermes Birkin Bags,Hermes Kelly Bags and so on,all of them is quality assured and beautiful,so buy Hermes Replica Handbag on our site,amazing surprise is waiting for you.

  22. Good article, thanks a lot.

    http://beolife.fr

  23. True Religion Jeans says:

    True Religion Jeans